11th Annual McGowan Forum on Women in Leadership: Women in Foreign Service

11th Annual McGowan Forum on Women in Leadership: Women in Foreign Service


>>Good evening thank you. I am Debra Wall
the Deputy Archivist of the United States. Welcome to National Archives for the 11th
annual McGowan forum on women in leadership, whether you are here or watching on YouTube we are glad
you could join us for tonight’s discussion. First I would like to take a moment to acknowledge the passing of the former first lady Barbara Bush her absence will be felt here at the Archives. The George
Bush library is part of the Archives. The President and first lady have been actively
involved in the library. My condolences to the Bush family and friends. Journalist author
and political commentator Cokie Roberts will lead tonight’s discussion with a distinguished panel of women who are leaders in American foreign service. The panelists will share their experiences, explore critical viewpoints and offer advice to young women entering into
the field. This program is made possible in part by the National Archives Foundation with the generous support of the William G. McGowan Charitable Fund, we thank both organizations for their continued support of our programs. Again, I would like to let you know about two upcoming programs here in this theater, on Thursday April 26 at 7 pm we’ll present a program called Remembering Vietnam-Medics Corpsmen and Nurses, the National Library of Medicine will be our partner for our panel discussion with Vietnam veterans and historians will recount their experiences explain the medical duties of medical personnel in Vietnam. On Monday April 30th at 10:00 a.m.in partnership with the Richard Nixon Foundation we will
host the Nixon Legacy Forum- Building the Branches. How Nixon worked with the Democratic Congress. Nixon Administration alumni will discuss how President Nixon and his congressional relations staff governed in a combative atmosphere. To learn about these and all of our programs and exhibits consult our monthly calendar of events on‑line at archives.gov, check our website or sign up at the table outside the theater. Another way to get involved is to become a member of the National Archives
Foundation. It supports the work of our agency. Especially our education and public programs. If you are interested you can pick up an application
for membership in the lobby or on‑line at archivesfoundation.org. Now I would like to
ask governor James Blanchard, to come up to the stage. Governor Blanchard is the chairman of the National Archives Foundation Board of Directors He previously served as the U.S. ambassador to Canada and
the 45th governor of Michigan and was a member of the U.S. House of Representatives from
Michigan’s 18th district. Please join me in welcoming governor James Blanchard.
>>Thank you very much. We have a great program for you tonight. I have the privilege of being
the chair of the National Archives Foundation board. Some of our board members are here. Welcome
to the panelist Fae Levin you are going to hear from her. My vice chair for doing it
is Cokie Roberts it’s nice to have someone like that having your back thank you. Diana
Spencer who is executive director of the William McGowan charitable trust is a board member and Diana is here with us of course and proud to be part of our foundation and I think Marilyn Cots is here as well who is
a member of our board. Let me just say our foundation does everything it can within reason
to support, finance and help and market many of the programs here at the national
archives. We are lovers of history and this is the house that houses America’s story,
America’s records and we have a wonderful and very fine archives staff , Debra being the deputy
archivist but the professional staff here is fabulous. We are very proud of them and
delighted to support the programs including this one that was and annual program of the
McGowan charitable trust and the McGowan Forum on Women in Leadership. and my next our next speaker is going to tell
you about the McGowan Forum and charitable trust. She happens to be from up state New
York we will know about that in a minute. Her name is Maryann Brand. You have been part of the board of the McGowan Charitable Trust for about 11 years. She has worked in trying to find way that is rural communities
can enjoy economic development. She started or created a food pantry dealt with early
childhood education, literacy and of school readiness, work skills programs. She is a full time job with
the Finger Lakes Tourism Alliance that’s up state New York most of you know that. We were
debating whether it’s the great lakes of Michigan or are the Finger Lakes beautiful she insisted
that it’s the Finger Lakes I say the Great Lakes you say either, all I can say we decided
they are both fabulous places on this planet, but for your fabulous work I am pleased to
introduce Marianne Brand.>>Thank you Jim in reality I said Michigan
had quantity the Finger Lakes in New York have quality.
>>You don’t want to start with that.>>(laughter)
>>He has many more years of political experience ahead of me so I am going to stop that conversation.
Thank you all for being here. Welcome to the 11th annual forum on women in leadership sponsored
by the William G. McGowan Charitable Fund and partnership with the National Archives foundation. I am Marianne Brand and a family
member of the McGowan Fund board of directors. William McGowan, CEO of telecommunications giant MCI was a self made global entrepreneur who never
forgot his humble beginnings in northeastern Pennsylvania. After his death in 1992 members
established and open ended charitable fund to honor Bill’s legacy and to preserve
his values and legacy. A driving force behind the McGowan Fund’s growing presence driving force was Sue Gin McGowan, Bill’s McGowan Fund board. Sue passed away suddenly in 2014. Under her leadership The fund gifted over 120 million‑dollars and effected locally based organization in the areas of education,
health and medical research and community service. Those grants supported vital services for
thousands of deserving Americans who otherwise lack the safety net. Today the fund
continues to strive for national level impact while supporting local regions and has now awarded
over 150 million‑dollar in grants. In 2003 the McGowan fund partnered with the National
Archives to develop this beautiful public Theater reflecting uncle Bill’s deep love of history,
movies and exploring contemporary issues. Shortly there after our board instituted an
annual forum bringing together industries and government leaders for lively public exchange
of ideas involving commerce, technology and government. Inspired by five years of enthused
audience response and top quality programming at the fall forum through Sue Gin and the board added
and annual spring forum this one women in leadership. It spotlights female leaders in the
fields of business and the military and journalism and academia and the arts and science and
medicine and echoes Sue’s life-long commitment to empowering women and their voices. Both Sue
and my uncle Bill would have loved to have join this conversation tonight.
Tonight’s impressive panel and moderator will explore the influential leadership of women
and foreign service. What have their experiences been? How has the role evolved over time?
Our panel will share personal stories and offer advice to women serving or aspiring
to serve in these roles. There’s always been such and honor and privilege for me to be
here and to introduce these forums in this amazing Theater thank you very much and
enjoy the program. Speaking for the staff of the National Archives I can tell you how
grateful we are for the beautiful Theater and all the support that you give us. Okay
it’s my pleasure to introduce our panel our moderator this evening is award winning journalist and author Cokie Roberts who among her many accomplishments has received the Edward R. Murrow Award and three Emmy Awards. Author of numerous books including Ladies of Liberty the Women who Shaped Our Nation. Joining her tonight are distinguished Panelists. Ambassador Melanne Veveer, executive director of Georgetown University Institute for Women, Peace and Security. Suzanne Rockwell Johnson President
of the Association for Diplomatic Studies and Training and Ambassador Linda Thomas Greenfield distinguished resident fellow in African studies at the institute of the
study for Diplomacy at Georgetown and Ambassador Faye Hartog Levin, Distinguished Fellow Chicago Council on Global Affairs. Please join me in welcoming our panel to the stage.>>Hello. Nice to see you all. So this is
a great event that the McGowan trust puts on every year. It has spurred on the archives
little help from the women on the board and to pay a lot more attention to the role of
women in American history and we are about to launch next year starting to the whole
process of recognizing finally this suffrage is so ridiculous it’s only the centennial
for women and a fabulous Exhibit called Rightfully Ours. We invite you to take a look at the
preparation for that and see what we have in mind which is going to be quite fabulous.
And it is wonderful to have this distinguished panel tonight and we have not explored this
particular subject before so it’s a good change for us where we really can learn about the
incredible things women have been doing to represent our country really from the beginning
and it’s appropriate that we should recognize Barbara Bush tonight because one of the roles
that is women have played of course is wives of and the wives are of diplomats have been
incredibly useful unpaid American representatives around the world and of course in Barbara
Bush’s case it was in China as a very interesting time which she enjoyed greatly but it was
right after the opening and so a fascinating time to be there and it was a very important
time to be an American to show China what Americans were because you forget how closed
it was a journalist had to have a Canadian passport to get into China. It was a very
closed off to American society mainly because of our views at the time. Women have been doing
in all of our history books about women there’s playing this role from the beginning, during
the revolution John J was sent to Spain they didn’t recognize him but they went there and
then and one of the Spanish officials wrote about his wife the fabulous Sarah Livingston Jay –
this woman who he loves blindly dominates him and nothing is done without her consent
so that her opinion prevails. There she was was and then in Paris in 1782 she arrived to help
her husband negotiate the treaty of Paris which ended the revolutionary war and was
adored by everybody in Paris she was just a bell, the bell who was very much the representative
of our country there. It was a good thing because Benjamin Franklin was doing thing
that is were not quite ‑‑ then following her, the Belle American – the American in Paris was Elizabeth Monroe
later when we had become a country and 1794 by this time of course the French revolution
had begun and Lafayette our great hero of our war was in exile and his wife was in prisoned.
Her mother and grandmother had already been guillotined she expected that fate for herself
and Elizabeth Monroe the wife of the James and who we don’t want to talk about either.
He was just boring and Franklin had other problems, so she got in the American carriage
and with all of the seals and shields of the United States of America baby country and
went to the prison and as a result of the interest of the United States of America which
was a very dangerous thing for you to do the marquees de Lafayette was released and
that was and incredible moment in diplomacy. And then later not much later Louis Katherine
Adams the wife of John Quincy Adams was in Russia and first she went to Berlin when he
was a very young ambassador and this was in 1797 and they adored him. The whole court
adored her but again not him so much. They called her the princess royal. It’s good thing
that wasn’t known here in the America because John Adams was President and they thought
he was monarchical enough. She had a baby and she had a lot of problems having babies
she had one that lived and the king of Germany or whatever it’s name was at the time Prussia
I guess closed off all of the streets around their apartment so she would not be bothered
when the baby was new so that’s the kind of influence she had and then they went onto
Russia and she was there alone a lot of the time because John Quincy was off negotiating
the treaty of Kent and ending the war of 1812. At one point she wrote to him when she was a big favorite of the very young czar Alexander and her sister was even a bigger favor which was also a problem,
but at one point she went and said I’m the only representative of America there, so she
saw herself in the role of the diplomat and it was right after Washington had been burned
and people had been offering their condolences and she said I was not so bad, considering how things are going and and old women or child could have serve the purpose. So women had playing these
roles from the beginning of our country but it took until 1949 for a woman to actually
be named in her own right as an ambassador so many many years after Sally Jay arrived
in Spain in 1780 that was Anderson who was the ambassador to Denmark and to Bulgaria
and then it took until 1965 to have an African‑American woman ambassador, Patricia Roberts Harris, so the women on this stage are really pioneers In the fact that we are still pioneering in the 21st century is a little depressing. It is a fact and we were talking
a little bit earlier about how things were, how they are and the changes, are they enough, no, but the changes these women have seen over the decades and I want to start with you, Susan because you joined the Department of state in 1979
and you have been posted pretty much every place in the world except east Asia but central Asia. All the stans, you did the stans. And Russia and Cuba and Iraq and Pakistan, tell us about the changes you have seen over that period of time for women and diplomacy.>>Well I think we are fortunate, You touched on some of the early instances, the fascinating examples of women and diplomacy sometimes it’s useful for me anyway for us to make a
little distinction between women and diplomacy and women in the foreign service? Women in
diplomacy as a career as commissioned officers and everything that was involved with achieving
that opportunity and then gaining from it because as you have said COKIE women have
been involved in diplomacy not only for our country but many other countries for a long
time and there’s fascinating instances in history. They have been involved partly as
sometimes as envoys sometimes to resolve a trade issue or perhaps a marriage between royal families
that was about to go off the rock a women envoy usually connected to the king or
the royal family or somebody of high rank was sent to deal with delicate situation this
is might be a moment to say that Tally Rand that’s kind of a chief or master diplomat
has said that in critical situations get a woman to resolve it. And I think there has
been many instances whether the women are envoys or whether they were spouses there’s
been a women in involved in diplomacy and achievements in diplomacy and as a history
major and now as the President of the Association for Diplomatic Studies and Training which
that name might not say it all but our main activity is the collection of the oral histories
of American diplomats in the post war period and we have 20500 of them and growing and a few
diplomats in the interwar period and late 20’s and 30’s fascinating stories it is a trove that needs to be more researched than it is and it includes probably about 2500
about 20 % are women because when we started 32 years ago as senior diplomats retired
there were virtually no women. It was only in more recent year that is we have begun
to really interview more and more women. We did start a spouses program and have about
150 or two hundred interview withs spouses we like to resume that because Cokie touched
on many long time past history our early history there are more fascinating stories of the
role that is spouses have played. Now, all of that stort of getting to the changes I
probably should mention that the women, the first women who are hired to work in the state
Department was in early not so early 19th century 1830’s and with great difficulty five
women were hired as copyiests and they had to have people copy documents.>>They had better handwriting, That’s really true>>Even before that their first role was as contractors or suppliers of services including copying services
but then at home because it wasn’t appropriate for the women to be in the workplace. So in
1933 one I guess precocious or forward leaning gentleman in the state Department made the
case and fought some battles to be able to hire five women copyists as clerks in the State
Department and that gradually over the 19th century led to women becoming confidential
clerks and then a few women becoming confidential assistance to what sounds as though it’s the
equivalent of the assistant secretary today and these were all in the civil service mode
and once they got in the positions they stayed for 20 years or more depending. So it wasn’t
until that the career foreign service was established in 1924 leading up to that they
introduced the examination civil service exam already existed. They introduced the foreign
service exam and the number of women took it and some passed and then it was a big problem
of what to do with them and what jobs to give because they could be sent abroad and all
kinds of stuff back and forth about that. The first woman foreign service officer, I believe her name was Lucille Atchison, in 1921 and at that time we were not
leaders in this area we were not the last of the pack but there were a number of European
countries who is had start anything 1912 and 1913 begun to appoint women to legations overseas
and some ministers we were not the first to actually hire women as diplomats.
The first women ambassador career foreign service officer ambassador was appointed
in 1953, so earlier than that it must have been a political appointee. I should say that
political appointments of women have opened doors and led the way and made it more possible
for women in the career services to move forward>>She’s looking over there because those two are foreign service and those two are political appointees
>>Well there’s always some kind of some kind of tension but I don’t think among women the
tension has been as great certainly not on a personal level. I have to recognize this
as much over politcizing can weaken the institution there’s really and important role
and in the case of women, women political appointees in Washington and as ambassadors elsewhere have set precedence in open doors and I think speeded things up that will bring me it’s
probable thri 1960’s that things began to move a little bit and John F Kennedy issued
a kind of 1961 statement about bringing women into federal government state and local government
and in 1967 Lyndon Johnson issued and executive order on equal opportunity. I am not as organized
as Cokie to have the exact wording of it. Essentially it talked about equal opportunity and non-discrimination on the basis of gender, race, religion.>>By that time the 1964 civil rights act had passed
>>Another thing that is very important that Coke mentioned isThe 19th amendment because after the women got the right to vote they began to apply and push to enter the foreign service as officers they wrote letters and took the exam
and did various things to try to.>>We probably have those letters here at the archives.>>So
the 60’s then in women in the 60’s and 70’s these were times when you couldn’t be married
there was no real family support what so ever there was no maternity leave
>>You had to leave your job if you got married as a woman the men didn’t obviously. It highlighted
I mean a lot was expected of women and at that time when if you got, if you were a women
officer you had to leave that was not true in all countries. Eleanor Constable who did and oral history was I think the first to push back about that
after in her entry class she was one of few women and she met a man or a colleague in
her entry and entry level class that they just clicked they knew they were going to
get married they took awhile for that happen. A few years later when it happened she had
a job in the State Department and she was called into the office of a I guess an icon
at the time who’s Frances Willis and she had sort of run the executive secretariat of the
small State Department then and she was an intimidating figure. Anyway Eleanor recounts
in her oral history how she was call into the office of Frances Willis and not quite
knowing what and the first thing that Frances said was to congratulate her on her marriage
and so Eleanor thought that’s very nice thank you very much and the next thing that Frances
said was when are you submitting your resignation? And Eleanor said I am not. And Frances said
when are you submitting your resignation? And Eleanor said show me the rule, show me
the regulation? Fully expecting Frances she said to turn to a drawer and pull out a document
and lay down the regulation, well it turned out there was no regulation there was no law
or regulation or no rule it was the custom and the practice and that really broke through
by the 70’s a number of women who were forced to resign were applying to come back and a
number of them did come back. Just to give a sense of you know where things started from
I didn’t come in since 1979, end of 79 and by that time I remember in my entry
class it was the small class of about 30 people of which five were women. I think at that
time women made up about 25 % maybe of entering classes or less depending on which class.
Today I think Linda would know better and about 50 % so it’s change a lot. That same
Eleanor Constable that I mentioned in 1986 just a few years after I had entered she was
ambassador in Kenya, and she was at that time she say it is only female career foreign service
officer ambassador at that particular time because there were so few and it wasn’t until
really well, the latter part of the 80’s and 90’s that we began to see more women and partly
because they had to have time they only come in during a career service it takes time to grow.
You have 20 years before at least before you get and ambassadorship if you are a woman
maybe more. You have to keep that in mind and only at that time. Today we have much
better representation in the foreign service and in the State Department generally and
even at the senior level. The question I think now for us is where do we go?
>>I want to turn to Linda here because you have been the director of human resources
you know where the bodies are buried.>>I didn’t bury any>>you probably wanted to
though.>>Yeah. Speak to where we are now but also speak
to your role as an African‑American woman which must have been also pioneering at the
time so where are we and how did you get from there to here?>>I came into the foreign service
in 1982 and in 1982 there were two class action suits against the State Department a women’s
class action suit and African‑American class action suit so I kind of had a double whammy
when I came in and I remember sitting through a security briefing, and one of the security
guys is talking about Russian efforts to recruit and he said but really you know if you are
in a place like Africa don’t worry about it. They are going to want to be with you because
you look like them. I raised my hand and the poor guy turned red as a beat. But that was
the foreign service that I came into. I had the small class as well.
>>He was saying the Russians wanted to be to the American’s because they were all white
I got it. We shouldn’t worry about anything because you know they are going to want to
be with you as well.>>Maybe not me.
>>And that was something throughout my career you know the unconsciousness or awareness
of people and you would sit in rooms and people would say certain things because you know
after awhile you mix in you’re part of the system and you are a woman and you are black but you
are one of them and they forget that you are a woman and that you are black and they say
something that they shouldn’t say in front of you and they might
>>They shouldn’t say it at all but they might want to say it front of you. That was kind
of the experience but when I came into the foreign service in 1982 I got married at the
same time and ‑‑ my husband was in the foreign service already and I got pregnant
at the same time within a few months. Just in case my older relatives are listening and
in 1982 the foreign service did not have rules for women taking the leave to have babies.
The rule was if you were a new officer or junior officer you could not take leave without pay and I
had been in the service for four months and I had no leave I remember saying at one point
that I am on the line in Jamaica and my husband was in the United States and I was going to
give birth to the baby on the visa line after tie her on my back and keep interviewing.
But the system was not geared to supporting women. I remember going through I finally
was able to get some relief from the then director general of the foreign service Joan
Clark a woman who made the decision to allow me to come back to Washington on leave without
pay I mean I wasn’t even being paid and they wouldn’t give me leave and she made that decision
and fast forward 30 years later I became the director of the general of foreign service.
We still hadn’t figured out some of the rules had changed but we still hadn’t quite figured
out what to do with women and I encountered a case in which a young woman was working
at a post in Mexico and her doctor wanted her to return to the states sooner than she
had planned and she asked to tele‑work. Because most of her job was sitting at a desk
and the system said no. Fortunately it came to my desk and I said yes and the rule was
suddenly please don’t send anything to the director general involving a pregnant woman
because she will not support you. I told them why I was paying forward because Joan Clark
had given me a break. Had Joan Clark not given me a break I would not have stayed in the
foreign service because I wasn’t given the choice you have to have a baby you have no
leaf you have to have a baby the choice was to leave the foreign service.
>>I went back to work with the baby at ten days old because there was no such thing as leave have to tell you it was so much better working than being at home.>>Yeah but you have to have the leave to have the baby.>>I was overseas so I had to be allowed to come back to Washington to do that but I have seen significant changes. We now provide paternity
leave for fathers and that didn’t exist before it’s still taking their sick leave but they
can take their sick leave and be at home with their wives when they are giving birth and
I think those are some positive things that have happened. As and African‑American I
think we are still going through tremendous changes in the State Department. It hasn’t
quite the state Department still does not reflect the face of America and when we go
overseas for me it’s important that when we go overseas that as and African‑American
when I walk in the room people know that I represent America because they know that we
are multi racial inclusive society. That is a message that is part of our message when
we are working with people overseas. I will tell you a funny story about Pakistan when
I was in Pakistan Nelson Mandela came to visit and this was about 1994 and 1995. And
there was a huge program for him and I walked in with our ambassador and colleagues from
the Embassy, and the Pakistanis pulled me away from the crowd and I didn’t know what
was happening, but suddenly I was sitting in the front row right across from Nelson
Mandela, and our ambassador was sitting up in the rafters. He was looking down like how
did Linda get down there? I was sitting there thinking how did I get down here and the ambassador
is up there and worrying about it? And at the end of the program there are about ten
people of color sitting down there and at the end of the program everybody left and
those of us sitting in the front row Nelson Mandela came down and shook all of our hands
I still feel the feel of his hand and thanked us for our service for the government of South Africa. the Pakistanis
assumed if I was black I had to be from South Africa, I couldn’t be from the United States
and that’s you know it’s funny but it’s not funny because people need to understand that
our country is a country of many different faces, and they need to understand that those
many different faces are a part of what makes our country great. Yeah.>>These are the stories we love to record.>>So Milane You became the first ambassador for global women’s issues and part of your job was showing
this face that we just heard from Linda of America”s women in all of our glory and
of bringing women from the rest of the world here to show that. Talk about what that job
was and how that worked inside the State Department.>>Before I do that I just want to say something
to Bill McGowan’s niece. I grew up in northeastern Pennsylvania if it hadn’t been for your uncle
howdy doody and Walter Cronkite would still been in snow, he made access to television possible
and then in serendipitous ways my husband was a young lawyer with the government trying
to help your uncle get a level playing field in terms of the competitive world at the time
so thank you very much. There’s a lot of meaning from me being in this room. To answer your
question Cokie it was a much like for Linda being and African‑American for me being
the first United States ambassador for women with also filled with symbolism because there
was something that sent a very powerful message about the values that we held as the United
States going into villages and higher places representing issues that were extremely important for women
in those places and extremely important for our own country in terms of our own national
security and places where women’s rights are savaged and were you know the rights are denied
and oppression is something that the daily occurrence of those places become among the
most dangerous place that is we have to deal with. These were critical investments that
we needed to make but there was a symbolic component as well and coming into this role
for the first time one of the things that I think made it easier for me to sure was
the fact that it was a position that was directly answerable to the secretary so there was the
validation of these issues from the secretary of state. I think that sent a very powerful
message and the secretary was Hilary Clinton as she was the secretary. And I was told from
the get go that this is not to be a special project positions. It wasn’t about a nice
project there or doing a project over on the other side but it was really about integrating
these issues women’s experiences and their perspective and participation into the policy
evolution that was taking place in the State Department and that was happening
in so many areas because the State Department has and economics bureau and the Africa bureau
and it had Embassies that were far flung around the world where Faye one of them and it
covered a range of issues from conflict and stability to human rights and to so much
in between and these issues, the issues of gender or women’s roles in these issues needed
to have some impact on what was going on as it was appropriate. So it was a challenge
to make that happen but there’s also I think a growing recognition of that you can’t write
off half the population of the world if you are going to do something about growing economies
which we know today can’t happen. You can’t have inclusive prosperity or jobs without
women’s economic participation. Women are critical to peace and security and critical to solving
problems of climate change and governance and everything in between. The real issue
is how to integrate and that became I think the way that the office functioned within
the wider State Department made it more possible and I never said to anybody you know we just
have to do this. We have got to do it. It was always how can I help you in how can I
make you better in your job because when we factor in women our outcomes are going to
be that much more better. It was in the self interest of others as opposed to my pushing some kind
of agenda. But with Linda for example there’s raging conflicts in many places but in the
DRC a conflict that still goes on issues of sexual violence against women that was used
as a weapon of the war loomed large. I was being hauled in before the Congress with questions
asked about you know why weren’t we doing something to protect women when they went
to get water or do other missions in the field they had to execute. Instead they were becoming victims in ways that are unimaginable. Working with the people in the Africa bureau and specifically having to do with the DRC at the time was and example of how we integrated into these
issues. I can tell you the first meeting we had with a group of people who were trying
to respond to these issues and the desk officer who I still remember very well for the DRC
looked in exasperation at me and said – what does this have to do with the Congo. It was an educative
process that had to go along at the same time you were really trying to get better outcomes.
Linda was our ambassador to Liberia there was a lot going on if you asked Ellen Johnson
the first president, female President of and African state what was critical in her election
and in ending that terrible civil war she would say the market women they play add tremendous
role. We found ways to work with the market women and that transition so that after these
8 years or 12 years she just stepped down as President and legitimate Democratic process
where the baton was passed and 12 years of peace and a lot of it was an invest in the women
in the world they had a play in the security sector and in other ways. Faye was in the Netherlands and I remember
her calling me and saying you know we are doing a lot in Afghanistan and the Dutch are
very engaged and they are going to hold this big summit can you come over and represent
the United States in what we are doing in advancing women’s progress they are recognizing
there would be no progress or peace if women were written out of that process during that
war and it continued. So it was and integrative model and that’s what we tried to do.>>Faye, so as
ambassador to the Netherlands you came in as a political appointee although you are
Dutch heritage and how did you find that? How did you find the response of the foreign
service officers particularly the women foreign service officers?
>>I am happy to answer that question but I would also like to acknowledge the reason
I feel so honored to be here first and foremost is that my connection to the Archive is through
Sue Gin who was a dear friend from Chicago where I lived. I was very pleased to be asked to participate
in this forum which I knew meant a lot to her. To be I am frankly humbled to be included
in this panel of such distinguished women leaders and I had the great pleasure of working with
Milan when I was in the Hague and saw her in action and saw what an incredible energy and dedication she had to the mission
and the assignments that you had so that was also both impressive and humbling. So I thought
about it in a dreamy way what it might be like to be and ambassador to the Netherlands
which was my parents homeland and they immigrated to this country after World War II. When
I actually was asked if I would like to assume that role I think it’s the only time in my
life I was aware of the fact that my heart stopped and when I was able to respond – yes of course- the next thing I thought was what have you just done? Because I though of all the people who have held that position in the Netherlands, John Adams, as my predecessors and I was thinking how could I possibly under take such a role and then>>He bought the first piece of property for he United States. I didn’t have a real estate background and
my political predecessors all had impressive credentials either in business or in security
or and I thought you know what do I have and so I thought about what I had done in my previous
careers and thought that I would use those experiences to try to bridge the divide between
a neophyte political appointee who has not had a career in the foreign service and all of the career
foreign service officers who had dedicated their careers and their lives to the service.
What I found was my respect and awe of the sacrifices that they had made to serve our
country throughout their careers deserved a special support from me so I said from the
beginning that I would not only take advice from them as to what they thought my role
should be as ambassador I want to know the ways I could support them in our roles because
getting ahead in the State Department always was from what I understood contingent on good
performance, recognitions, evaluations and so on. I was very aware of that and I was aware of the special challenges
that women had. Because of the sacrifices they had to make I was surprised to see how many
women in the foreign service did not have children and if they were married how frequently
they were not able to get tandem assignments in the same country.I thought about that as quite a sacrifice. so I tried to pay special attention to, them. I think that it may not have been universally true of all of the women’s ambassadors in
the Hague the women ambassadors in the Hague were naturally drawn to each other it was
a special group we all valued each others experiences and perspectives that was a special
experience for me as well.>>Melanne you were and ambassador in Liberia with the first African female President
was that something special?>>It was I knew her before she was elected
President I got there in 2008. I see one of the colleagues that was there with me from
USAID. We felt that we had to help her to succeed. That was my instruction from Secretary Rice. Who was then Secretary
of State to do everything possible to help her to succeed. That was not difficult because
she had the right political sense she knew what needed to be done. Because she worked at the
world bank and she spoke our language. We We were able to do some extraordinary things in Liberia including the fact she kept the country at peace for 12 years. She did everything in her power to promote
women and to encourage and support young girls, and to improve education and she did all of
that with very little. When she started as President in 2006 the budget of Liberia was
80 million‑dollars. When she left as President until she left about 500 million in the central
bank coffers and the budget at that point had reached close to four hundred million. We
are still not talking a lot of money. I used to tell her I had more money in my Embassy,
more money in my account as the assistant secretary for Africa than she had as President
of a country it was a tough, tough job that she had. It was a job that had never been done by a woman before in Africa. As we look
back she received the Nobel Peace Prize, and she received the
recognition for freedom and leadership, for what she accomplished. And I think my being there as the American ambassador
I was the first woman ambassador to Liberia a country that had ambassadors since the since
Monroe and many of them African‑American. I was the first woman and we and that was
extraordinarily powerful for her and for the Liberians that we women, and there was a third
one that the head of the UN, Ellen Lloyd and we called ourselves the troika. We made Liberia
work and that’s something I was extraordinarily proud of. We were able to make it work because
we had a capable leader at the helm.>>We now reference Secretary Clinton, Secretary Rice, Secretary Allbright it must have been remarkable to you as a long term foreign service officer to see these women at the helm by the time Clinton people started to say was there something
about Secretary of State that you say women’s work. I said there have been three since Thomas Jefferson. (laughter) but did that
make a difference?>>You know I am glad you asked Cokie because I in
preparing and thinking about this event this evening. I was asking the same question to
myself we have had three women secretaries of state in high visibility positions and
what impact has that had either on American diplomacy more broadly or on State Department
itself? I was thinking of you, Melanne in particular on this that there are two issues that having
women secretaries of state I think really helped bring to the fore in a new way and
one is women’s rights are human rights themselves and the other one is the trafficking issues.
Those two issue in particular never had nor I think would have had or would have today
the prominence that they have. Were not for having those women secretary of state. Thinking about women in high visibility position there i an immediate focus on gender and you think
gender is a success or failure is attributed to the gender and often that is really not the case. That gender is a factor
and it can be important but the success or not it comes from the ability of the experience
the individuality of that person rather than gender. But it reminded me of a glass
cliff which is the other side of the glass ceiling. When ever there is a risky or precarious
difficult situation where whatever you do you are likely to annoy or offend a lot of
people then give to it a woman. Partly because a man doesn’t want it or partly because there is a feeling women are going to do better with that or willing to assume risks that men sometimes are not in
these particularly in these kinds of situations it’s something to think about as we think
the women Secretarys of State as we look to the future.
>>Condolessa rice finally got recognized as an act of war that took a long time. Those three women Secretarys of States made important contribution on diplomacy and what the content in some of our priorities
and thanks to people like you around them who help them do that whether that was you
Milan or you Linda or many others including men. So I think now, as far as on the State
Department itself that’s more difficult question because it still kind of complex, and I am
not exactly sure how gender effected or didn’t effect what went on in the state Department.
We are struggling with this I would like to see a lot of issue that is have been defined
around women for a long time shifted to focus more on family and individuals because I
think a lot of them are family issues whether you can have a child or get maternity care
I know that survey that was done five or six years ago showed that 40 % of men said that
when they’re choosing or what they are going to bid on or what assignments they will take
or go after they take into consideration how that’s going to what opportunity there is
will be or won’t be for their spouse or their children or the family because it’s the whole
family enterprise. We are moving in that direction.>>There’s the whole focus on work life balance
in the State Department that didn’t exist even about 15 years ago but one of the thing
that is we are seeing that we haven’t quite figured out is that there is still a reticence
on the part of women to take more senior positions. And we find that women don’t step forward
to put their names on deputy chief submission jobs and even on some ambassadorial positions
and when we discussed it with them many made those decisions because of family reasons
and occasionally we will have a male employee make the decision because of family reasons
but it’s not always the case with our male employees. I found as the assistant secretary
really nudging women forward you can do this. I have two kids and I was able to do this.
Don’t hold yourself back. Push yourself forward and these things tend to work themselves out.
There is a sense now that as we look at women in senior roles they are not stepping forward
as boldly we would like them to step forward.>>Like in politics every woman is asked who
is going to take care of the children. I never ever heard ever ever ever a male politician
asked that question and as far as I know most of them are fathers so it is you know it
is endemic. Today the Senate voted today to have a baby on the floor. Yeah. They actually had debate
about the baby.>>I just want to follow up on something Susan
said about the role of these three female secretaries and for anybody who was around
when Madeline was being considered to be secretary it was all out war going back and forth in
the front pages in the Washington Post as to whether or not she was actually capable of
being considered for that job. She was opining about this not too long ago amongst some friends
about what it meant and her granddaughter is listening to this conversation and she
finally said I don’t understand what the big deal is? It’s a girl’s job? Then when we think
in a short time frame that child concluded it was a girl’s job that is a sign of progress. But Madeline
created the first women’s office within the State Department and in those years one of the first things that she asked
to be done was cables the cables that would come in from the Embassy would begin to report
on what was happening to women in those countries were the girls if school where there oppression
or human rights being violated. This had never been done. There was no reporting going on on the condition of half
of the population of those countries and what that would mean for the United States and
the process. And she really did work very closely with Hilary Clinton who was first
lady at the time and Madeline headed our delegation to the fourth World Conference on Women in Beijing,
Hilary keynoted that conference and women’s rights as human rights then began to be considered
in ways it had not been considered in the State Department. I had several women on the staff of the human rights division of the State Department tell me that when that was over they were
arguing for child marriage or female genitalia mutilation and issue that is have become human rights issue and were told those aren’t human rights issue we don’t consider those issues and they would refer back to that speech.
This has been a trajectory and Condi Rice was a resolution in the United Nations really began
to move the whole process of dealing with sexual violence and conflict when the resolution
that she put forward really did create both sanctions for this which was the first time
they were considered for this and but also lay out the fact that these violations could
be crimes against humanity in terms of their pervasiveness and what was happening in those
countries so on women’s issue the women clearly had their mark, so my mother was ambassador
to the Vatican at this time that Madeleine Albright was secretary and she was the first
woman ambassador to the Vatican and putting her in the position of representing Bill Clinton
to the Pope. She made trafficking a huge issue and people were so surprised, this nicey nicey old lady ice old lady was in there every day talking about sex trafficking and really got that
whole NGO community that works out of Rome involved in that issue and that was
>>Linda referenced USAID and when we were putting together this panel we got
and e‑mail saying nobody from USAID did. I thought that was a very legitimate comment
and because we know the incredible. In fact a lot of things we are talking about girls
education and all of that is carried out by USAID and of many many of those workers
are female. Tell us about your experience with that? I wanted to make and observation
with respect to your previous question about the female secretaries of state. As we were
talking earlier about the fact that when I arrived in the Netherlands there was a great
sense of relief that the United States had maybe finally come into the 21st century and
elected an African‑American to the presidency and there was really great respect for the
country for having done that. And western Europe and to certain extent eastern Europe
has had so many female leaders that they are a little perplexed as to what’s taking this
country so long to get there? So you know when I was in western Europe there was not
only female foreign ministers or secretaries of state but there were female defense ministers in a
couple of countries of course prime ministers and so in some ways we need to keep pushing
women leaders in all of the various context so that the rest of the world realize that
is we are not as backward as we look. You know in terms of USAID the Netherlands for
example has and office within the foreign ministry that is called the development
director and they didn’t distinguish as the between diplomacy and foreign aid it was
all part of the same you could correct me but it seemed to me to be all part of the same
effort to support countries and people in need for human rights or other rights or other
needs and the people who were working in USAID were considered part of the foreign
service just in some ways the military or the Marine that is we are serving over there
were considered part of the cohort in my Embassy there were leaders from I think 15 different
federal agencies and they were all even though they were civil service officers for a particular
agencies they were all viewed as diplomats at the time they were serving abroad. USAID
is doing terrific work but I think has been connected at least in the State Department
as a branch of the State Department and so the work they do is essential to the rest
of the work that I think the foreign service office has been trying to do.
>>So we are going to turn it over to you in just a minute. Be thinking of questions
and we need you to go to microphones because it is being streamed. I want to we promised
in the introductions that we would be giving advice to young people coming into this field
so Linda again there’s somebody who did human resources and was head of the foreign service
directory can you talk about that?>>I think as I now spend quite a bit of time
mentoring and encouraging young women and particularly in my perch at Georgetown the
message I have given to them is that there are no limitations on what you can do. There
are no jobs that you can’t do. It took me years to learn that I could do anything. Most
men know that the day they are born. They assume it’s the day they are born and it takes
us awhile. What I encourage young women to do is step forward and be bold and so you
used to say dream big and if your dreams are not big enough to scare you they are not big
enough so that’s my advice to young women is look for opportunities and no opportunity
is the wrong opportunity. No road is the wrong road to take. Had I not accepted and assignment
in Pakistan which is not my area I am and Africannist. I would not have ended up in
Geneva in a position that I think really launched my career. And so jump at opportunities
even the wrong one and make them work because sometimes you are presented with opportunities
that people think you can’t succeed at and that you think you can’t succeed and you pull
yourself back. I dive into every opportunity that’s presented to me and failure is not
and option.>>Okay.
>>Applause.>>Let’s start here.
>>Thank you so much for being here tonight it’s truly inspirational to hear from you all.
I work at the Africa bureau at the State Department. I would like to ask about a topic that I think
is plaguing a lot of women my age myself included imposter syndrome for those of you not familiar
with it the more you achieve in your career the more worried you are going to feel that
you don’t belong there or everybody is going to catch on I am a fraud. I would like to
know if you experienced that in your career and if so what have you done to overcome it.
>>Anybody want to take that?>>I think it is true that women have this
lack of confidence that men don’t seem to be plagued by and we often hear about you
know going for the job where the job description has five key areas you need to be and some
gentleman may not have abilities in any but one and who will go for it convinced he’s going to get it where the women may have four plus and anguishes over whether she should apply. I think we have got to find ways to get over this fear of failure if you will and understand
that you know look at it as a myth out there about women and come to grips with the fact
that we are capable and we can do these things and we are not imposters and you can do it
as well as anybody else. I do think this is an issue that we have to contend with.
>>I think that ‑‑ the answer comes Frankly with age you know you say at some point I
have been doing this and I know how to do this and I am good at it. At some point you
will give yourself the peace. So go for the promotion. And don’t doubt your self. I have
been many time in a room and I look around the room and I am the only woman and I am
the only person of color you know there’s 30 white men in the room and me. I have never
asked myself do I belong here? Sometimes I wonder if some of the guys belong there? (laughter)
I have never ever questioned my right to be there and so you have to be confident in your
self and even if you don’t feel confident never show it. Never show it.
>>You know you do have and advantage because I mean for years of my life I was the only
woman in the room now there are more women in the room, and it still happens even at
my age and stage I’ll say something in the meeting and a guy will say the same thing five seconds
later and everybody will say that’s a great idea and the big difference now is that other
women in the room will call him on it and say Cokie just said that. They don’t know
that because they just wait were your lips to stop moving. (laughter) but it does
help to have cohorts.>>That really is something that we need to
do for each other and I had a friend who said she has made it her campaign to really get
women to say when they are at the table that even though some women’s comments were discounted
and then it was made by a gentleman it was the well, that was just that it was own idea
as when she said it. We really owe that to each other. Absolutely. Over here. My name
is Eddie and I wanted the State Department is made up of othersthann foreign service I
think three of you are not foreign service and I wanted to know how the treatment of
women in the career service and in the political appointees and the contractors who who play a major role for sure at USAID who are treated and how that affects the treatment of those women in those
other three components and how that affects the treatment of the women in the foreign
service.>>I think we addressed that earlier with
the Susan was saying that the women who are the political appointees make a difference to
the women who are the career people. I am certain that’s true as well with women working
in the field as contractors.>>It certainly is and I know in my case and
in Liberia where we had a significant number of contractors and we had a variety of people
in different roles and for me they were part of the team. And the only thing that matters
to me was competence and I didn’t care what kind of personnel card people carried. I do
know that in some places that’s not the case. In many of those cases it’s the result of
people who are just not good leaders when they don’t value the employee that they
have and don’t value their work.>>Apologize I just want to clarify what I
was trying to say is those in the career service who make up a large portion of the State
Department have a collective a lot of them are part of a bargaining unit and have a collective
bargaining agreement I am wondering how that affects those in the foreign service the protection
that people get from a collective bargaining agreement for example the ability to transfer
leave and when one has a child or when one adopts a child how that affects those in the
foreign service that was my question I am sorry I didn’t say it precisely.
>>That was my question I was speaking of firsts here and there I was the first elected
female President of the American Foreign Service Association which is the union or exclusive
employee representative of the foreign service. And I believe that you can say that it has
made a difference it has a made a difference in the conditions of employment of foreign
service officers over the last 40 years in terms of advocacy for things like family support
and leave without pay and you know all kinds of different thing that relate even if
it’s just reimbursements that you get or updating of regulations that you know otherwise sort
of lie there you know formulated in the 20’s or 30’s and nobody is updated them, so the
civil service does not have as strong a union in the State Department as the foreign service
does and contractors don’t have it at all. Now sometimes they may benefit because what
the union asks to negotiates and gets applied to everyone. So I think at state that has
had a positive impact.>>John?
>>I was wondering over the course of your careers if any of you have ever been publicly
called confused?>>She doesn’t get confused. She made that
quite strongly.>>I don’t know if I was called confused but
at one point I was deputy high representative and supervisor of Birshco district in Bosnia
I was the first woman or supervisor of biershco district. The high representative at that time was Patty Ashdowne there was a kind of a built in tension between the high representative and the supervisor of Birchco district who was double hatted as a deputy because all the powers of supervisor had come from and international tribunal and they predated the authority of the high representative. You were technically the deputy but you had certain
mandates and things to do per the tribunal award that the high representative did haven’t
a say on. So he sometimes thought that not just me, my predecessors my male predecessors
too and his predecessors there were several comments they made sort of in public about
these sort of obstreperous supervisors were who were going off on their own and not with the program
or whatever.>>I am confused. I have never been ‑‑ now
I have been confused.>>Hey exactly. We were working on the Afghanistan
program and there was obviously some disgruntlement in the White House that there was a push to
have certain policies adopted for women in Afghanistan and there was a big quote that
didn’t escape any of us in the Washington Post that said this is just somebody’s pet
rock. We all got really upset about that because it was far from a pet rock and we weren’t
confused>>Cokie mentioned Lindy Boggs and representing
a philandering President under the Vatican. I am curious how does it affect women diplomats
when you are working under someone who’s possibly misogynistic, does that affect how you are
accepted and how do people deal with that? (laughter)
>>I just want to know how Calista Gingrich is doing in the Vatican? I don’t think anybody
has worked for a person who they think is Mysogynistic right?. Am I wrong?
>>Wrong.I think, its a tough one sometimes you think you ignore it. You move on. You develop a thick skin and don’t let that interfere or stop or phase you in some way. If the misogeny is directed then that rule applies.I’ve had two bosses where that has happened. at you and you had the State Department and E EO cases were filed against them
>>I think he was talking about the President.>>I fortunately haven’t had to work for him.
>>(laughter)>>We are retired…>>Just ambassadors.
>>(laughter)>>Hi there. My name is Sue Kaplan and I
really appreciate your comments about how women are making the world realize that we
may not be quite as backward as we look to some other countries I think another way we
can do that is follow Iceland which this year in 2018 requires by law that all men and women
are paid equally for equal jobs. And I think it’s well past time
>>It’s well past time.>>I think having enough women in HR roles
will help that. You can create your own hash tag it’s something that needs to make the
news. I know they spent all of this time cover that women still only make 80‑cents on
dollar and the pink taxing of different things that women buy and dry cleaning and that type of thing and it’s
ridiculous it has to end. I did the little research the only place that women are paid
equal as the men is in the brotherhood of electrical workers.
>>I need to join that union.>>Equal pay was introduced in 1946 so here
we still are. Were you able to deal with that as a human resource officer?
>>No when you are in the civil service the rules are so strict in terms of pay you come
in with a certain education level and a certain level of job experience and you are paid at
that level. Yeah the veterans benefits. There were some discrepancies when I think about
when I came into the foreign service in 1982 and you got certain steps if you had if you
worked or if you had a certain degree and I did notice that some of the men got more
steps than I got. I didn’t know to fight. I only found out later that I should push
for two additional steps which might have meant a couple extra thousand dollars. I do
know of an experience where we brought into two contractors and of one a woman and
one a male and the male said to the women employee new right out of college this is
a wonderful job I am starting out making 58, 58,000‑dollar as year and she was making 38.
And she immediately pushed back and said this is not acceptable and she was given the increase
salary.>>Yeah I have been thinking about the imposter
question. I was thinking about in terms of Madeleine Albright is a quote that she uses
frequently about there’s a special place in hell women who pull the ladder up behind them
and so one of the things that is might be helpful is to form a relationship with a mentor who
can maybe push it past some of the roadblocks if you find them in your career that are self
imposed and not necessarily externally imposed and I have been asked many many times to mentor
younger women and not necessarily familiar with their field but just I guess thinking
or knowing that many times in my own career I just asked for the job or the promotion
and I have to encourage them to just ask for it.
>>It reminds me of a story that’s told about Bill Burns it’s highly respected deputy secretary
we all know him. He was offered ambassadorship to Jordan at one point. He said why are you
offering me and said I am not ready and he went and did something else and then got the
ambassadorship. I’ve thought that it is important to have the confidence and to know you are aiming for competence and to be able to do the job. You don’t want to set yourself up to take the job for a title you can’t do or are not ready to do. Have
the confidence to say I’m not ready for that but I would like that job I want to be ready
for it and I need to do this first. I think it’s, he got a lot of credit for having said
that and I think it helped him in his career and it’s certainly ‑‑
>>I wonder what would woman if would have said that that’s and interesting thing
I don’t know. We have got to get to the point where we can say that.
>>In that period they wouldn’t have been given that opportunity. Women would not have
been offered that job. She may have been offered a job in the Marshall Islands which
was I offered. I came in first class with Bill Burns and I didn’t think that Marshall
islands was the right job for me because I am Africanist why am I going to Marshall
islands?>>So this question is for Ambassador Greenfield
but to the rest of you broadly thank you so much for saying that there’s a diversity issue
in the State Department and international affairs broadly. Sometimes you’re the only
person of color or the only person with your experience so thank you for saying that’s
it’s important to hear. When you are faced with those situations when people are saying
things or you feel there might be an issue around your identity or your mistaken as not
American which often happens when you go abroad which is African‑American. How do you handle
the situation with grace it seems like there’s something motivating you farther and what
do you what do you call on I guess what do you use to motivate you to keep going in those
situations each though you are probably some experiencing some tough times and you are
doing everything everyone else is doing?>>That’s a great question I always assume it’s not
my problem it’s their problem. I will give you a great example little funny I had a wonderful
special assistant a little bit older gray hair and we were in Africa and we went into
a room and all of the protocol people thought she was the assistant secretary. And they
kept saying you sit here which was to sit closest to the President no, no you sit there
and I said Andrea sit there. She sat the President walked in the room and he knew me and I was
sitting in the back of the room. He came walking up to me and said why are you sitting back
here and his people nearly died. I got a lot of pleasure out of that. (laughter). Sometimes
you just have to let it happen. People make their mistakes and they will learn the next
time that they need to ask and I try never to take it personally even when I know it’s
personal I don’t let people know that I am taking it personally. I let them live with
their embarrassment.>>Thank you.
>>You know this question of diversity is so important because think about it the countries that you are going
to represent the United States or America are countries where people are most people
or most of the countries in the world do not have white skin and to only send white people
from America makes no sense what so ever.>>Not at all. We have time for one more on
each side.>>Hi
my name is summer Lindon I’m and interested recent graduate in joining the foreign service.
My question is about the future of women in the foreign service with your reflections
on the women who led before you and help lead the way and lead by example to bringing more
voices to the table so then continue onward and in a career in the foreign service at
the State Department. At what points in sort of the journey to a career ambassador level
or and ambassador level at the state do you see there’s the most struggle for women and
what can you do to address it?>>You know I think there are extraordinary
opportunities for women in the State Department today. One of the reasons is most of the senior
women have gone so it’s room to move up. So since then I think there is a shift in how
women are viewed 50 % of the incoming class are women. There’s no choice other than for
women to move up. You don’t go into the foreign service to be an ambassador. I maybe a little
off maybe 240 ambassadorships total. In a service that brings in 6 to 8, 000 people.
You are not coming into the foreign service to be an ambassador. You are coming into the
foreign service to be a successful foreign service officer and if you are successful
in a 20 year career you have reached the pinnacle. if you become amd ambassador that’s just cream
on the top. It comes with a lot of responsibility and
>>Usually a nice house too.>>(laughter)
>>Only in Europe. You didn’t see the house in Liberia.
>>You saw the house in Liberia the only thing about the house in Liberia was and old British
barracks but the only thing about it was right on the ocean. That was pretty nice but you
don’t always get nice house it is European houses are quite nice.
>>You know we talked about what a difference it makes when African‑American or other
minorities can be in countries that might not see the United States having representatives
in coming out of those situations and it’s true of women as well. I remember when Madeleine
was being considered for ambassador and some one said she will never be able to be considered for or Saudi Arabia and she said I will go as the representative of the United States and they have to deal with me as the representative of the United
States not a woman. I think again the symbolism of whether it’s women or a minorities is a
very powerful symbol of the United States.>>Final question.
>>Wow quite the honor. Thank you all so much for your service to the State Department and
the foreign service. I am happy to say that I will be startling in two weeks at the consular
my name grace. I am in the interesting position of trying to prepare my husband for life as
a tag along spouse. He will not be going as a tandem spouse his talents are not in international
affairs. I know that the State Department has done wonderful things to improve support
for families but is it all geared towards the classic foreign service wives or are they
ready for a foreign service husband?>>They are ready.
>>Absolutely they will I have had in my experiments not a career foreign service officer but so
many time the career foreign service officers in the various countries I visited the women
were the officers and their husbands were with them but not in the foreign service the
State Department went out of their way to make sure they are gainfully employed to be
able to participate in the way>>Go State Department.
>>(laughter)>>There’s an organization called the AAFSW
the American association of foreign service wives. They kept the same acronym it’s association
of American foreign service worldwide or something like that. There are plenty of partners and
male spouses et cetera that belong to that organization and they help each other and
they help find employment opportunities.>>s. good news.
>>he is not going to be serving tea. My husband accompanied me he retired from the foreign service. He accompanied me to
Liberia and the accompanying spouse. He said I will do everything a spouse is supposed
to do but I’m not doing tea. He never did the tea but he made amazing barbecues and
was a very competent member of the community.>>I once went to lunch to two friends of
mine and once was incoming after one was outcoming, and they were women and one of them was asking
tips of the other one about what to do about the husband and it was about the funniest
conversation I have ever been part of. I was so thrilled to be there listening to the tips
it was great. Thank you so very much. Thank you this was a good conversation.
>>Thank you for coming and come back for our many wonderful programs here. Thank you.

Danny Hutson

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